Latin France-American diplomatic relations

In an interview led by Christophe Bieber and Florian Lafarge, Jean-Pierre Bel, former president of the Senate (October 2011-September 2014), returns to his report to Latin America and his mission as the French president's personalFor Latin America and the Caribbean, a mission between January 2015 and May 2017.

Christophe Bieber: Jean-Pierre Bel, you were appointed by the President of the Republic in this singular post of personal envoy for Latin America and the Caribbean, can you explain the link that binds you to this region?

Personal relations play a lot in this region, probably more than elsewhere.Personally and from a very young age, I am Hispanizing and I have always felt as a certain proximity to this culture.This proximity is linked to my personal origins, close to Spain, as well as to my first political commitments in solidarity with anti -FRANQUETTES.

At that time, the internationalist dimension was an essential element of politics.The ideological element is also important in our training and our vision of the world.This is not confined to France and in the 1970s and 1980s, the fight was much wider: Vietnam, Africa and of course Latin America with the period of dictatorships.One of the most striking events was the coup in Chile and the assassination of Salvador Allende.Personally, this event has formed a significant part of my convictions.It is regrettable today to see that the word "internationalism" has lost its strength and that it is so difficult to project ourselves elsewhere.We are far too stuck in Europe.

Later, as a parliamentarian, I quickly got a taste for parliamentary diplomacy which, beyond official, traditional diplomacy, makes it possible to overcome certain cleavages, and to keep links that are always useful.I then got a taste for this international and internationalist aspect.

The state often has distrust of this parliamentary diplomacy but it can also use it.I also learned a lot in the Senate.As president of the upper room, as it is customary, I receive many heads of state and, because of my old link with the region, I am more comfortable with those of Latin America.As part of my duties, I also carry out travel everywhere and, in January 2013, I go to Cuba with the intuition that we had to accompany the country's economic opening efforts.I had the ambition to see the fate of Cubans improve.I was then the first important political personality to make a visit from that of Claude Cheysson in 1983 and I was received by Raúl Castro.

Florian Lafarge: On January 14, 2015, François Hollande set up a personal envoy for Latin America.Originally, what was the aim of the President of the Republic?Why did you name this position and what did your role consist of?

First of all, it is necessary to specify that it was a volunteer mission.The essential reason is a political will of François Hollande to look from French diplomacy to Latin America and the Caribbean in order to devote more efforts to it.There is a certain logic for this decision: when one is a president from the left and the Socialist Party, we necessarily have an international policy which presents certain left markers.On this point, it is clear that Latin America speaks to many generations of left -wing activists, whether communist, socialist or another sensitivity.To be interested in the Chilean left, Cuban or that of Argentina, it was undeniably placed in an internationalist left policy.

The trigger for the creation of this position is when I invite Isabel Allende, the daughter of Salvador Allende, to visit me in France as part of my functions as president of the Senate. While we approach a number of subjects, she surprises me by addressing the President of the Republic to say to him: "If you want to turn to Latin America, we should do a bit as we do in our countries Latin American. What would be useful is a envoy, a personal envoy who would be responsible for these questions and Jean-Pierre Bel told me of his decision to stop the presidency of the Senate, it would be great. Not only does she give him the idea of ​​creating a position but she designates me as the one who could occupy him. This is anecdotal, because this is not the main reason for the creation of this function, but this is how it was mentioned for the first time. François Hollande, because of his appetite for international questions, wanted to get closer to these subjects and he necessarily has the memory of the general's trip, but also more that of Mitterrand, perpetuated by a large number of personalities from the French left Like Régis Debray or others who led him to reconnect with this region. Beyond his personal link with Latin America, he knew my interest in the area. There was then a kind of conjunction that fell well. In the past, there had been a precedent which was not exactly the same, but which approached it, in the person of Antoine Blanca who was sent by Prime Minister Pierre Mauroy. There is a form of continuity therefore for a left -wing president to get closer to Latin America through a personality whose role would be to bring our two cultures closer.

CB: What did your missions consist of?How did you define the priorities of this diplomatic work?

There were two major concerns. The first was to ensure that France was present in these countries in a privileged way and therefore that I can, as a former president of the Senate and then as a personal, represent the president of the French Republic in important moments. This is how I participated in many investitures of new presidents, as an example I will quote Mexico with Enrique Peña Nieto, Bolivia with Evo Morales, Uruguay with Tavaré Vasquez, Argentina with Mauricio Macri . I was also able to represent France whenever it was necessary. I was at the disposal of our ambassadors stationed in Latin America whenever this was useful for France. In total, I thus visited 30 countries, still with the aim of supporting French interests. I thus accompanied French companies whenever it was necessary, as in Kingston in Jamaica to open the doors of the presidency to CMA CGM for the port of the capital. We were in the era of economic diplomacy. It was an important aspect of our diplomacy that was wanted by Laurent Fabius. I took it all my part. I was also able to represent our country during major events such as the enlargement of the Panama Canal or during Latin American summits like that of the Pacific Alliance.

Then the second concern was to listen to Latin America in general, which consisted in receiving in my office at the Élysée Palace many ambassadors from the region. This role was appreciated by the Latin American diplomatic community who saw there a privileged interlocutor of the president, attentive to their concerns and available. This availability was much appreciated because the ambassadors had a more direct relay with the presidency and had the assurance that their messages were communicated to the President of the Republic. Even today, many of them have nostalgia for this period when they had an entry office at the Élysée, with someone who was there not only on the occasion of Latin America Week - which was certainly an important moment - but also whenever there was a brand guest to first welcome then then make it received at the highest level, for some by the president, and for others by the Prime Minister.

More concretely, I was interested in making the link, to receive political and diplomatic figures, to follow all the projects that could come from our country towards Latin America, whether on economic, cultural, orothers.

FL: How did you insert yourself into French economic diplomacy?

My role could be similar, in a way, to that of a facilitator.I had to listen to the needs of our diplomatic posts in Latin America.Often, the ambassadors were preparing a visit program to me, which was useful in countries with a deficit of official visits like Paraguay.

This is why the fact that a personal envoy of the President of the Republic, former President of the Senate, number 2 of the State, went to a country, was an obvious advantage.This has never been done before and it allowed France to have a much more important presence in the region.

This is why I still haven't digested certain criticisms that come down to saying that, from Pompidou to Macron, Latin America has not been considered.It is to disregard the action of France under François Hollande during his five -year term.I will not quote here all the trips of the president, nor those of the Prime Minister and the ministers in the area but there are many, much more numerous than that could have been said.

FL: So there is a real will on the part of President Hollande to project France into Latin America by your appointment but beyond it, what was his vision of relations with this area?

Je pense que nous étions dans une période internationale très compliquée avec la suite des Printemps arabes, la situation en Libye, en Irak, en Syrie et en Égypte. Très logiquement, l’une des premières préoccupations françaises en termes diplomatiques est le bassin méditerranéen. L’Afrique représente également un sujet très complexe et, dans le fond, je crois que le président Hollande, du point de vue international, a cherché à élargir l’horizon. Bien sûr, on ne peut pas comparer la relation que nous avons avec les pays du Maghreb avec celle qui est la nôtre vis-à-vis de l’Amérique latine mais ouvrir l’horizon, cela veut dire retrouver aussi la trace de l’influence française dans d’autres pays et se souvenir que, si nous avons été présents en Afrique, dans le Maghreb et ailleurs, nous l’avons été aussi en Amérique latine. Lorsque j’ai voyagé, que j’ai rencontré tous ces chefs d’État dans tous ces pays et, au-delà des chefs d’État de ces pays, les populations, je me suis rendu compte que souvent la France avait une certaine image, que les pays, les citoyens de ces pays, connaissaient la France et que pour certains, c’étaient des relations extrêmement proches. On oublie trop souvent l’importance de la France dans certains pays, comme en Uruguay où au XIX^e siècle quasiment un tiers de sa population était d’origine française. Quand on connaît l’influence des philosophes des Lumières dans la plupart de ces pays, quand on sait que les constitutions de beaucoup d’entre eux se sont inspirées de la Révolution française, de la Déclaration des droits de l’Homme et du citoyen, on se sent presque une responsabilité vis-à-vis de ces pays pour ne pas laisser dépérir cet héritage qui est un atout pour la France. Se détourner de l’Amérique latine, c’est tourner le dos à ce qui a été l’histoire de ces pays, ce qui a été l’histoire de notre propre pays, la France, qui est totalement imbriquée à la leur. Donc il faut se réapproprier cette histoire qui est la leur mais qui est aussi la nôtre, et créer des liens avec l’Amérique latine, c’est aussi un peu assumer cette histoire.

FL: What was the reception in Latin America of your appointment and this French projection reaffirmed to this area?

It’s hard to say for me because it would be considered self -sufficient, but my appointment had an important echo.The proof: each time, it is at the highest level of all these states that I have been received.

The gesture of President Hollande to appoint as a personal envoy one of his closest, which is more former president of the Senate, was very well received.In Latin America, the personal dimension of relationships between people, the relationship of trust between individuals, even if they are personalities, even if they are very strong.By this appointment, we touched straight at the heart.I have also received many recognition brands and I have been decorated by several countries.The Latin American ambassadors in Paris even wanted to organize a ceremony, in the presence of the President of the Republic, during which they gave me a sort of trophy which they had all signed, thus testifying their thanks to President Hollande and tomyself for what we had done.I think it is still present in memories, in the conscience of the Latin American who are in Paris.

CB: You had, as president of the Senate, started to weave these links, you had made some trips, you had already had contacts ...

Yes, this explains why we had created Latin America day in the Senate.I was not yet president of the upper room, it was just before, but I was in any case actor of this idea of creating a day of Latin America which, every year, brought together all the Latin-Americans.As such, we had therefore already worked to strengthen this relationship.When I was a senator, I didn’t travel so much.But that has changed once it became president of the Senate without it having led me to favor one region of the globe to another.Nevertheless, these trips were sufficient to allow me to better know a territory for which, anyway, I had a real tropism.

FL: What were the key moments of your mission?

All the trips were, in a way, unique, and I would not want some countries to feel reduced, but I felt that there were two important moments which showed that we have crossed an important diplomatic stage with FrançoisHolland.

The first is at the time of the visit to Mexico for the inauguration of Enrique Peña Nieto and that, during a tête-à-tête with him, by a personal discussion in Spanish, we end up the Florence Cassez affair, case which was a thorn in the foot of our bilateral relations for too long.It's a highlight because Mexico is not just any country.While he is just invested president of the Republic, Enrique Peña Nieto has received me for an hour and a half when he has been president for a few hours.I don't imagine the same thing in France.There were other heads of state, and in particular many Latin American heads of state but, on the European side, perhaps I was one of the most visible.

Then, the second highlight is François Hollande's state visit to Cuba.This is a historic moment: it is the first visit of a European head of state for practically a century, which gave rise to the visit of Raúl Castro in January 2016 in France.So why is it important?Why is it historic?Because in this period and for many countries, Cuba was a little the front door on Latin America, so even if there have been alternations that have changed the situation a little at the Latin-American today, at that time for all countries, whatever their sensitivity, the fact that France was interested in Cuba meant that France was interested in Latin America.

CB: Have you experienced more sensitive moments, moments of tension?What about the flight affair of the Evo Morales plane and the declarations of the Overseas Minister, Victorin Lurel, during the funeral of Hugo Chávez?How did you perceive these political moments, sometimes presented in the press as trial and error in French diplomacy in Latin America?

The two events you mention are very different. The first was felt as a humiliation of a Latin American head of state, which is more an Aymara of Bolivia; It was a symbol. We quickly understood that an error had been made. The President of the Republic, I can tell you now, had no responsibility for this decision: he was not informed in time of the provisions that have been taken, which made him very furious. We tried to make up for things quickly. President Morales understood the state of mind of François Hollande who had it on the phone that evening. The latter, at the time I was still president of the Senate, asked me if I was ready to go to La Paz to apologize and these steps were well received, contrary to what we do Spanish who camped on their positions, which caused a deterioration of their relations. This link of Latin American states with what was formerly called the "Patria Madre", the motherland, is not always in good shape. Despite the "incidents" linked to the ban on the overview of the French territory by the plane of the Bolivian president Evo Morales, the latter will not hold it against France and François Hollande. He even said to him, before me in the form of a joke, that if he represented himself before the French, he would vote for him. At the ceremonies following the re -election of morals, I represented the French government. In this sense, I was the highest European dignitary with the president of the Spanish cortes. I then had an exchange with Evo Morales: he remembered having read that I had hung a photo of the che in my student room and reminded me of this anecdote at that time.

The second, Victorin Lurel's statement, was, on the contrary, so dithyrambic compared to Hugo Chávez that it was considered something a little curious.There have been since so many irritants, as they say in diplomatic language, and sensitive subjects with Venezuela that the declaration of Victorin Lurel was not a pretext for a deterioration of relations.

FL: There was also on the Latin American side a rather favorable political situation, with in particular governments, progressive statesmen, left, center-left, who were closer to the political positioning of François Hollande.Was this situation to help?Was it that could weigh, facilitate relationships?Can we speak of a kind of alignment of the planets?

François Hollande should be asked who, in my opinion, would reply that he has relations with states and not with governments because the most important is to promote both bilateral relations as those with the whole continent.

Nevertheless, it is clear that when we come from the left and from the Socialist Party, we have a stronger sensitivity for Latin America.When we made the trip to Chile, we visited the Museum of Victims of the Coup d'état of Pinochet.Naturally the visit, made with Michelle Bachelet, Isabelle Allende and François Hollande, was undoubtedly stronger in emotions because of the context, even if the solidarity which was testified at that time with the Chileans who had to undergo a dictatorshipwas not the prerogative or monopoly of the left.There were also right -wing personalities in France who denounced the acts of these dictatorships.

This left can be inspiring, certainly there is no model to calculate on ours, but I sincerely believe that European social democracy can rebound, can try to reconstruct an ideological corpus, by learning Latin American experiences and inInspired by these left forces.

FL: What was your relationship, or at least perhaps the relationship of France with the other countries present in the region: Spain, the United States and China which, in recent years, has become an essential partner?

For my part, as a personal representative of the president, I was dealing exclusively on the relations of France with Latin America.The relations I have had with the United States, China and Spain are relations that I have had within the framework of my official functions as president of the Senate.I met American officials, I made official visits to Washington DC, Spain, I went to China and I received Chinese President like the King of Spain in the Senate.

But I could see the reactions of certain states following the various initiatives of France in Latin America.The Spaniards, for example, were very surprised to see that France was taking foot in Cuba and feared for their influence.

Regarding the United States, I have nothing to say because for me, the mark of a French foreign policy is independence and sovereignty.Disagreements can exist even if we are an ally country.

For China, we analyzed how she proceeded to set up in a number of countries.At first, the said Chinese influence area was rather in the south of this hemisphere, the southern cone, the United States being more directly linked to the northern part of the region, in Central America and below.Today, it is no longer quite true and we can see through the theorization of silk roads what the Chinese are trying to do.We must campaign for normal competition for foreign investments and in particular for French investments in this region of the world.It is necessary to ensure that we can fight on equal arms, that's all.

CB: What was your articulation with the other French administrations present in Latin America, namely the Quai d'Orsay [Ministry of Foreign Affairs], Bercy [Ministry of Economy and Finance] and the French Development Agency (AFD)?

I had excellent relations with the Quai d'Orsay.I was in direct and permanent contact with the entire team of the Directorate of the Americas which, at the Quai d'Orsay, is responsible for these countries.It was the same with his various ministers, Laurent Fabius then Jean-Marc Ayrault.I had no worries and it is almost difficult to believe so it seems great to say that we were in an ideal situation.Our ambassadors in the countries of Latin America have, I believe, could be seen because they all gave a very positive opinion.Every year, there is the conference that brings together all the ambassadors in Latin America and, each time, the work I was doing with them was cited in a very positive way, which was not at all acquired.At the start, I was a little afraid of being an elephant in a porcelain store but it went very well.

For AFD, it's the same.I discovered it in this context.It is an agency that seems extremely effective, which does a great job.Together, we continued its establishment in Latin America by opening offices which today constitute examples in Ecuador, Cuba, Bolivia, Argentina and Peru.

With Bercy, I didn't necessarily have direct links since it was the Ministry of Foreign Affairs that was responsible for it.It was more complicated at the time of the Panama Papers, because even if we wanted to be uncompromising, we had at the same time the desire not to break all the links with this country, precisely to make it possible to progress in the direction of transparency but alsoTo defend what we represent in this state.So I found myself getting stuck between Bercy's concerns and those of the Quai d'Orsay, which was not always easy.But on a file such as the resolution of the Cuban debt to the Paris club, since the director general of the Treasury presided over the Paris club, we worked together in the same direction and it was a great success.

CB: Between the two foreign ministers, Laurent Fabius and Jean-Marc Ayrault, was there a change in politics?

Quite honestly, I haven't seen any significant change.The team of the Directorate of the Americas of the Quai d'Orsay remained the same and we had the same enthusiasm.Presidential trips under Laurent Fabius as under Jean-Marc Ayrault continued at a fairly sustained pace.

FL: What was your operating mode with François Hollande?

Our operating mode was informal and I was going to see it when I wanted it.It was enough for me to warn him, of course.I had to see it once a week and, in the more hollow moments, every two weeks.Our meetings were very regular because he followed with attention all the Latin American files and I made him very precise reports of my actions.

CB: The success of COP21 owes a lot to that of COP20, organized in Peru.What was your place in this device?

In my trips, I discussed each time a certain number of points and, systematically, there was the preparation of COP21.For Peru more particularly, I closely followed relations with this country, especially at that time with President Ollanta Humala.It was something complicated, because internal affairs in Peru are very complex and often disturbed by family problems or linked to corruption.It was therefore necessary to ensure that all these subjects do not pollute our bilateral relations and have no impact on the negotiations relating to COP21.It was a very relational and diplomatic role.

We could also count on the action of Jean Mendelson, Ambassador COP21 for Latin America, to whom it was responsible for going around these countries to ensure that they would go in the right direction, that isTo say in the sense of the success of COP21 in Paris.

CB: The position of personal envoy for Latin America has not been renewed under the chairmanship of Emmanuel Macron, do you know why?

No.I can only consider some hypotheses.Either on the principle, there is a disagreement about having somewhat specific positions for certain regions and reluctance to delegate.The method of chairing is different, at the level of the presidency as well as of the government.Either Latin America may no longer be a priority, given a different context, which I can quite understand, just say it.

CB: General de Gaulle has made trips to Mexico and South America which have remained in the memories.François Mitterrand also sought to take a particular look towards the area.What historical references did you in mind during your missions?

I was as inspired by the trip of General de Gaulle as by the Mitterrandian era, especially by the way in which we helped the countries prey to the dictatorship.You know, I have always been very attracted to Latin America as a whole, its culture.I experienced all the fights against dictatorships in a very direct, very close and very militant even, but I was not every morning saying to me "we are going to put ourselves in the footsteps of François Mitterrand".

I felt rather inspired by being the representative of this France that they continue to look at the heiress of Victor Hugo and the Revolution.

FL: In terms of Guyana, how this territorial anchoring, this geographic presence could make your action in the area facilitate?

In a way, we are a country in South America by Guyana.But today, these relationships remain to be developed.In François Hollande's policy, there was a strong wish to ensure that our overseas, Guyana, Guadeloupe, Martinique, etc., be in a particular relationship with the Latin American countries and in particular the Caribbean, that they are a kind of window of France in this region and that they facilitate the bilateral relationship.